Episode 255 - Braydan Young/Todd

 

Todd Westra

Braydan Young

 

 

02:03 Welcome to the What it Takes to Scale Podcast. Today we have an amazing guest, Braydan Young, who's coming to us all the way from the Northern California Marin area. If you're familiar with the area, gorgeous, supposedly the hometown of mountain biking and Braydan, we're so glad to have you onboard today. Welcome to the show!

My first ask of you is, please tell us who you are and what you do.

 

02:30 Yeah, so my name is Braydan Young. I am the co-founder, and I call myself Head of Growth of Sendoso, which is just a title you can use for startups coz, does it really make sense? I do everything from sales to success, you name it. Yeah.

 

Right.

 

02:47 What Sendoso is?  We are a gifting and sending platform. So we help companies send anything out from branded swag to e-gift to cupcakes, you name it, to customers, to prospects, to employees. We do it all. And then, we take all that information, we track it back into your CRM to show success with the power of direct mail.

 

So, you are basically trying to link gift-giving to the actual revenue growth of the business.

 

03:13 Yeah, like the power of reciprocity is one that works really well, and we do a very good job of tracking emails, of tracking phone calls, but we didn't really nail the idea of tracking actual physical direct mail. Like, like none of that really lived in the CRM and so we, we kind of draw a direct line to what happens with direct mail, push all that data back to you to show that hey, this is just as successful if not more successful than emails, ads, etcetera.

 

03:38 You literally are one of everyone's favorite types of people because you, you come in and you bring the goods, and people love to receive goods all the time, right? I mean, is there anyone that doesn't like receiving swag?

 

03:53 I think so, we started with just $5 Starbucks gift cards, and it's amazing how powerful we used to call it coffee center. It's like, okay, here are five bucks a Starbucks. And like that was one of those things where folks were like, this is great. Like, of course, I'll take the meeting. Like, thanks, I can grab a coffee.

And I quickly turned into doing more than just coffee. I was like, how can I do physical things or cupcakes? Socks was a big one for a couple of years ago or Yeti mugs. It depends on what folks wanna send, which is really great.

 

I love it. I love it. So, as you've like taken this from the start, how long have you started the business?

 

04:22 Seven years ago, we started it. We were, the original plan was to leave it as a just a hey, like, let's see what we can do on our own and kind of self-fund it. But then we were like, we'll take a little money. And then we took a little more and then a little more, and then like, it was a much bigger issue or challenge that folks were having than we thought. So we kind of absorbed swag closets from companies. So we went from just me and my co-founder to now we're well over 500 people across the globe and have offices in more than four different countries, which is fun. I mean, it's fun to see the growth there. We went from one warehouse to seven, so having seven warehouses is a fun system to figure out where all the stuff is. But, like, it's grown pretty fast. And one of the big things was we didn't think, like, COVID was one of those like silver linings for us where everyone went home, but everyone was like, Hey, I wanted people to send stuff first and like, or, or send stuff still. Like that was, we were in the right place at the right time for those last three years.

 

05:17 That is a good time to get embedded in these companies cuz I don't think that anyone that noticed the advantage of sending gifts to people is gonna stop doing it now. Now tell me though, like you've grown from you and your partner to 500 plus people, all these warehouses, all these locations, four countries. What's been the favorite part of that growth journey in your mind?

 

05:40 I think one of the big ones is really hiring. So when you start, you kind of hire your friends, and you're like, okay, like hey, like these are folks who are gonna come work for me, and they're working with me. And then as you keep going, you start to, you figure out like, Hey, I need somebody who has like these sets of skills. And, like, it's really fun when you actually get to go out and hire, and you're like, Hey, our hiring plans are, let's just find the people and bring 'em in. So that was one of the really big ones. I would also say like moving from a hey, like, let's just get everything done, and if there's a problem, we all jump on it. Actually, having a process and putting process in place at a startup is a very big pivotal moment for most startups. It's like it's no, it's no longer like everyone all hands on deck. It's like, no, here we have steps that we take to solve like this sort of challenge or this sort of issue. And that was pretty fun to learn from, cuz I've always been anti-process. And so to learn how to have actually a process in place has been really cool learning for us for sure. 

 

06:37 I mean, come on, you're a swag guy. You know, you go from being the swag guy into like, okay, we're delivering for how many deliveries a week now?

 

06:47 Yeah. I mean, we went from just having like a couple customers to well over, I think, now we have well over like 5,000. So it's one of those things where it was like, Hey, like we're sending out 30,000 plus packages a day, and we need process when things go down. And that was a lot of learning.

We're also, we, we weren't sure how to do warehousing. We figured that one out too. So that was the that's a ton of processes that all took time. And, uh, that was definitely was scaling. That was where we learned the most is you need to find people, experts that know how to do that process. Cause everyone's like, there's someone who's done this before. And so to find them and to bring 'em on board was really important for us early on.

 

07:22 I love it. You know honestly, In this type of interview, I've interviewed lots of people, and they always say the biggest hurdle that they run into is like, people, processes and tools and, and you happen to like be providing a tool- I would say in some sense, but like you had to create this whole system. What was your biggest challenge? Like, did you hit revenue hurdles where you were just kind of like stuck? I mean, you mentioned that you raised, a few rounds of money. What did you do when you found yourself not losing money, but you're making money, but you're just not quite scaling the way you were envisioning?

 

08:01 Yeah, so the background for myself and my co-founders were both sales guys, so our entire careers have been like, hey, like we've been AEs and SDRs, and so we knew how to sell. And so when we were, when we were first building the company, it wasn't built yet, but we were already selling it. So we were trying to get customers in line to be like, hey, like this is the, like, you sell 'em on the vision. Like here's what we're building, here's, here's why it's gonna be fantastic. Get in line, pay us like, you know, pennies on the  dollar. Once it's ready, we'll give it to you. And we had lined up probably 10 or 20 customers before the platform was even live. And so, like, that was a really good idea for sales, but the engineering side had to catch up to it, and the products, I had to catch up to it. So that's really backward to a lot of startups-

 

08:44 No, no, you, you're probably the only founder that's ever done that.

 

08:49 like you have an amazing product, but like, you don't have any sales. So like, like, like, like that's kind of one, one of the big things where you're like, oh, like I, I don't know, like, you know how we're gonna go out and sell this thing, or, or, or the product's so great. It'll sell itself. So we, we kind of had a different challenge there, and engineering had to catch up, and because, like, I can't code and my co-founder can kind of code, we needed to find resources and folks who could help us do that.

 

Right.

 

09:08 So one of our biggest challenges was scale, was how we were gonna do that, and do it in a time when there were a lot of startups. I mean, back in, like, 2016, 2015. It was like the heyday. Everyone had their own concept, and VC money was flowing. And so it was one of those things where like how you were gonna do it, where you're gonna find those folks. And so we did it abroad, and a lot of those folks still work for us in Lahore, Pakistan. And so we flew out there. Basically built an office, built an amazing team, and like we were, we got really good at wireframing early, early days, and they would build it at night. The next morning you'd have it. So the early challenge was having a lot of sales with the product not there yet, but like, like knowing how to identify that, I think was, uh, important in the first year. And then from there, it's like once everything was even, you sort of like tried to figure like, all right. like where do I wanna invest? Like if you invest too much engineering enough in sales or vice versa. And so that was, that was a challenge for us. I mean, it still is today, but I think every company has the exact same problem.

 

10:06 So, that was your first, like, like a big hurdle in scaling, but like, were there points in when you were growing that you were, you felt like, okay, what, what do we do next? I mean,how did you overcome that hurdle of, Hey, we're making money, we're doing great, but should we go into this next country? Should we go into this next like niche? But what kind of challenges did you get?

 

10:28  Yeah. Yeah. I mean, like we, so what we did early on was we looked at our customers, especially our early, like those 20 customers who signed it before we had a product. We kind of brought them on as advisors for us. We,re like, hey, like our champion there. We were like, we want you to come to help us build this platform out and let us know what, and like let us know what you need.

And that was massive to our success because someone would be like, hey, I need you guys to operate and build a warehouse in Dublin, cuz I do- or in Ireland, cause that's right, we’re be sending. We're like, all right, we gotta figure that out. Or I need you guys to plug into ABC integration because all my sales team is using that.

Like how can we make that work? So like, that was really important. The other side that we got lucky on was being sales folks. We knew that partnerships were key to our success. So the first couple of years, so today, we lived in our partner's offices. So we were like, hey, like this is what we do. This is why it's great.

So like, sales guys would close deals for those partners. We'd be behind them being like, Hey, do you think they need what we do? And so like, and like, you wanted to make all those folks advocates of yours. And that was we, we knew that was the next step. And still, that's a major key to our success is like, hey, how can we make sure our partners love us and wanna work with us?

 

Because no one buys really on an island, especially now. And so you really want to have like that established. That was the front of the product, the warehousing, one whole different beast. We needed experts there cuz we didn't have the expertise there. That was, we needed to find the right people and hire the right people who knew how to scale that. And we knew that was a big piece that we needed to find, for sure.

 

11:55 So you not only, you not only were really focused on your client journey, but your customer journey became your huge referral engine.

 

Yup!

 

Is that right?

 

Exactly.

 

Love it!

 

12:06 I mean, like, there was, there's one of those things like referrals where like that's, there are the best deals. I mean, I think that you, everyone knows that. I mean, if, if you're raising money, every time you're on the phone with a VC, you're like, hey, I see you're on these three boards. Do you think they'd wanna use our product? And somebody like all that should be looked at as prospecting. I think and like that was important to us and still is.

 

12:25 I love it. And did you get referrals from prospects that you didn't take their money from?

Like referrals from like, from like, like from VCs?

 

12:34 Like from people who were, were interested in funding, and you didn't actually take their money, but you took their referrals?

 

12:40 Yeah, I mean like, I think, I think it's just, you know, it's, it's kinda like you didn't, you say no to a deal, but you get somebody to, you know, help you out. I think that like it's all worked out in the end. Maybe they came in a later round, or maybe we've made recommendations to friends of sorts of companies.

 

12:50 Cool. Cool. Now when you see other guys, because I know you have people like in your circle who are, who are founders and they're trying to start a business, probably a lot of your clients are in this boat, but like when you see them struggling with what you dealt with? What kind of, what's the first piece of advice do you find yourself giving to your clients when they're trying to grow and scale?

 

13:09 I think a lot of it is, I mean, it changes us through the years, but I think in the early days, it's if you have an idea or a concept for a company, are you need to tell everybody and you get your pitch right. I mean, whether it is in a bar, or out at a friend's house or whatever have like, you constantly are talking about it and seeing what people's reactions are. Like you're trying to adapt, like what, like what your pain points are trying to solve? As you grow? A lot of folks have done this before. There's a, I mean, your podcast is, is a good example of like people wanting to share information and so people are willing to give information like, Hey, here's what I did when I went through this, and it's all advice.

 

Right.

 

13:44 And so I think like the power of like something like a LinkedIn tool. If you find a founder who's in the space that you're in or trying to build in to reach out to them and say, hey, this is what I'm doing. This is why I think it's cool. Like, would you be willing to give me five minutes if I, you know, send you a coffee?

Or if I, you know, just say thank you or give you a recommendation. Like people are typically willing to give it. I mean, especially in hubs where there are other startups or other tech companies like most people are willing to give advice. It's like, hey, here's what I did.  Like take it or leave it.

This was awesome. And so that was the biggest one, is you don't need to do it on an island. You can ask for advice and ask for advisors, and you don't have to give equity. You don't have to give things like that or money. It's more than people just want to help and see other people succeed.

 

14:25 You know, people always assume that's what people want in exchange, right? And yet, to your point, like I, I was gonna ask you, what do you do when you find yourself with questions you don't have answers to? Is there a mentor? Is there someone in your group that you kind of go to? How do you get that advice and input?

 

14:42 Yeah, I mean, like, so we have a, so like those early customers that we brought on? Like they've now jumped companies many times, and those people are still advisors for us. And so we, we ask them often about questions that we come across your VCs that you take money from or people you talk to typically have like people in residence there, they can, they can answer questions for you. You can reach out to folks that are in your space. I think even, even competitors are people that if you have a question that's like focus on the space and it's a big, massive question like the tams were all in are pretty massive, and so and so to have a question like hey, this is what we're running into, are you in something similar?

How can we, you know, help each other solve this?

 

No kidding.

 

15:19 I think those are all important questions to ask, but it's important to be kind of an open book and offer the same advice back, and so I think that that's, that's important for an advisor that you might have.

 

15:30 I love it. I love it. Now, this is this has been a fantastic interview and, and I gotta ask you kind of a fun question. Yeah. Cuz people are always asking me from a marketing perspective, you know, are opt-ins still relevant? What's the last opt-in you actually got on and filled out your information on before you got any information from someone back?

 

15:47 Like the last like email opt-in saying, Hey, like, send, send me information?

 

15:53 Either an email or something pops up on a window

 

15:54 Man. I don't, I don't even know. I, I, I think. Maybe with, uh, like, I was looking at insurance today, like homeowners insurance, and you have to like opt-in to all these things? So like, it's, what's funny about it is like, I'm willing to spend money, and you opt-in for, like, emails to get from, from those folks.

And the content and the marketing there are horrible. And so, like, it's one of those things where, but you have to opt-in for them to actually converse with you. And like, I, I don't even read it. I just click the button and move on. But, like, that's actually a good question that, like, I just don't think it's really relevant anymore, if I'm being honest.

But, I followed the extreme of, like, I like to share information. Like I wish Netflix would be like, Hey, you've been watching Netflix for three hours. Like, you wanna get a pizza? Like, we'll send one to your door. I think that, like, that information, I love to share that.

 

16:40 Dude, that's a great product hack. I love that. That's a, maybe there's an API that you could get to, hey, if viewer has viewed this many hours straight, send me a lead.

 

16:50 Right. I mean Amazon's clause where it's like, hey, like we noticed you hadn't gone grocery shopping in probably a week, so you probably have no food. So you wanna order some dinner tonight? Like, here's an option for you.

 

17:00 I love it. Braydan, thank you so much for your time today. This has been an awesome interview. I know people are gonna get some value out of this, and just anything else you want to leave us with to kind of close and where can people find you?

 

17:12 Yeah, I mean, like, my hello@sendoso goes directly to me and to my co-founder Chris, like that's a, it's actually a bug in this. We haven't figured out how to fix that yet, so use it. Email us if you have questions. We're there. Uh, I mean like, if you haven't tried gifting things yet to customers, I mean, it's easy to do.

It's like a lot of sites are free. So give that a shot. See how customers respond, or prospects respond, and I think that once you're ready to go to the extreme with it, give us a call.

 

17:38 I love it. Well, thank you so much for your time, man. Have a great day!